Carol City's 3:11.50 is super but Miami Killian in 1969 was even better
05/06/2019 2:06:14 PM
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There is no question that the depth of quality in Florida high school Track and Field today is much better than in "the good old days," especially in 1A and 2A. Nevertheless the greats of the past should not be ignored when reporting "All Time" bests. At State in 1969 Miami Killian won the Mile Relay (4x440 yards) in 3:11.8. Using Track and Field News conversions that converts to 3:10.9 for 4x400. Almost all the "yard" performances of the past have been bettered in recent years, but three oldtime ones still are superior. Besides the 4x4, Brett Hoffman's 8:53.1 2 mile in 1977, which converts to 8:50.2, is superior to Sean Jefferson's 8:59.03 for 3200, and Arthur Blakes's 13.0 for the 120 yard High Hurdles, which converts to 13.3 for the 110 hurdles, is better thah Eddie Lovett's 13.46. Explanation: T&FN says that for handtimed races one should add .24 for races shorter than 400 and .14 for longer races. Then multiply the yard times by .9942 - and round up to the next tenth. The high hurdles multiplier is 1.0025.
There is no question that the depth of quality in Florida high school Track and Field today is much better than in "the good old days," especially in 1A and 2A.
Nevertheless the greats of the past should not be ignored when reporting "All Time" bests.
At State in 1969 Miami Killian won the Mile Relay (4x440 yards) in 3:11.8. Using Track and Field News conversions that converts to 3:10.9 for 4x400.
Almost all the "yard" performances of the past have been bettered in recent years, but three oldtime ones still are superior.
Besides the 4x4, Brett Hoffman's 8:53.1 2 mile in 1977, which converts to 8:50.2, is superior to Sean Jefferson's 8:59.03 for 3200, and Arthur Blakes's 13.0 for the 120 yard High Hurdles, which converts to 13.3 for the 110 hurdles, is better thah Eddie Lovett's 13.46.

Explanation: T&FN says that for handtimed races one should add .24 for races shorter than 400 and .14 for longer races. Then multiply the yard times by .9942 - and round up to the next tenth. The high hurdles multiplier is 1.0025.
05/06/2019 2:24:11 PM
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Thanks Geoff. I will defer to your expertise on these issues of past performances and undoubtedly you are correct for the relay. The MileSplit conversion table converted Brett's time to 8:49.91 instead of 8:50.2. Using either figure, Charles Hicks time of 8:49.62 from Arcadia this year would be just under it, so I believe that would be the new record for 3200 / 2 mile.
Thanks Geoff. I will defer to your expertise on these issues of past performances and undoubtedly you are correct for the relay.

The MileSplit conversion table converted Brett's time to 8:49.91 instead of 8:50.2. Using either figure, Charles Hicks time of 8:49.62 from Arcadia this year would be just under it, so I believe that would be the new record for 3200 / 2 mile.
05/06/2019 3:17:09 PM
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[quote=dddd]Thanks Geoff. I will defer to your expertise on these issues of past performances and undoubtedly you are correct for the relay. The MileSplit conversion table converted Brett's time to 8:49.91 instead of 8:50.2. Using either figure, Charles Hicks time of 8:49.62 from Arcadia this year would be just under it, so I believe that would be the new record for 3200 / 2 mile. [/quote] Yes, Hicks's time is the All Time best. I was just talking about State Meet records. Brett Hoffman's time of 3:53.1 at State converts as follows. Add .14 because he was handtimed. Thus 3:53.24. Multiply by .9942 equals 8:50.147208. Since it was handtimed you round up to the next tenth. Thus 8:50.2. I can't help but wonder what Hoffman might have run if he had the sort of competition Arcadia provides. Nevertheless I'd take Hicks in a match race. After all, Hoffman is a wee bit past his prime. :)
dddd wrote:
Thanks Geoff. I will defer to your expertise on these issues of past performances and undoubtedly you are correct for the relay.

The MileSplit conversion table converted Brett's time to 8:49.91 instead of 8:50.2. Using either figure, Charles Hicks time of 8:49.62 from Arcadia this year would be just under it, so I believe that would be the new record for 3200 / 2 mile.


Yes, Hicks's time is the All Time best. I was just talking about State Meet records.
Brett Hoffman's time of 3:53.1 at State converts as follows. Add .14 because he was handtimed. Thus 3:53.24. Multiply by .9942 equals 8:50.147208. Since it was handtimed you round up to the next tenth. Thus 8:50.2.

I can't help but wonder what Hoffman might have run if he had the sort of competition Arcadia provides. Nevertheless I'd take Hicks in a match race. After all, Hoffman is a wee bit past his prime. :)
05/07/2019 2:43:16 PM
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All of the state records are not up to date.People were getting credit for records that they didn’t even break .By the way North Western ran 310 that’s the record
All of the state records are not up to date.People were getting credit for records that they didn't even break .By the way North Western ran 310 that's the record
05/07/2019 3:15:59 PM
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There are definitely some State Meet records that were off. Most noticeably was Caitlin Coller's 800m time from last year, 2:02.77.
There are definitely some State Meet records that were off. Most noticeably was Caitlin Coller's 800m time from last year, 2:02.77.
05/07/2019 7:25:45 PM
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[quote=172525cj]All of the state records are not up to date.People were getting credit for records that they didn’t even break .By the way North Western ran 310 that’s the record [/quote] Did Northwestern run the 3:10 at State?
172525cj wrote:
All of the state records are not up to date.People were getting credit for records that they didn't even break .By the way North Western ran 310 that's the record


Did Northwestern run the 3:10 at State?
05/07/2019 11:37:15 PM
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@geoffpietsch It was at UF Relays. She was acknowledging it would be the [u]State[/u] record, while you were actually referencing the [u]State Meet[/u] record.
@geoffpietsch It was at UF Relays. She was acknowledging it would be the State record, while you were actually referencing the State Meet record.
05/07/2019 11:48:24 PM
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@CoachRaposo Thanks for the clarification. It would be great if Carol City and Northwestern battled head to head at Golden South or another post-season meet. I hope they do so but given how long ago the season started in Florida and how hot it is in Miami this time of year, I suspect lots of kids shut it down after State.
@CoachRaposo

Thanks for the clarification.

It would be great if Carol City and Northwestern battled head to head at Golden South or another post-season meet. I hope they do so but given how long ago the season started in Florida and how hot it is in Miami this time of year, I suspect lots of kids shut it down after State.
05/08/2019 12:24:59 AM
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[quote=geoffpietsch]It would be great if Carol City and Northwestern battled head to head at Golden South or another post-season meet.[/quote] @geoffpietsch That would have been great, however NW ran the 3:10 two years ago.
geoffpietsch wrote:
It would be great if Carol City and Northwestern battled head to head at Golden South or another post-season meet.

@geoffpietsch That would have been great, however NW ran the 3:10 two years ago.
05/08/2019 12:34:42 AM
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@CoachRaposo At least I didn't say Miami Killian's 3:11.8 mile relay team should be there too. :) Must be past my bedtime. I'll shut myself down before I do any more foot in mouth... :)
@CoachRaposo

At least I didn't say Miami Killian's 3:11.8 mile relay team should be there too. :)
Must be past my bedtime. I'll shut myself down before I do any more foot in mouth... :)
05/08/2019 6:29:50 AM
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Can anyone imagine what Killian’s time would have been on a synthetic track? Ouch Certainly better than any present state challenger
Can anyone imagine what Killian's time would have been on a synthetic track?

Ouch

Certainly better than any present state challenger
05/08/2019 6:34:35 AM
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@mbecker There are certain records , races and times ( like Jim Ryun’s mile or Michael Carter shot put, Houston Mctear’s 100 yard etc .. that can simply never be matched .
@mbecker

There are certain records , races and times ( like Jim Ryun's mile or Michael Carter shot put, Houston Mctear's 100 yard etc .. that can simply never be matched .
11/22/2020 8:50:36 PM
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@geoffpietsch I actually ran in that record setting high school mile relay race in Gainesville 1969. I ran the same leg as Larry Black. You really really had to be something to GET to state, where there were 16 teams. To qualify, you had to be 1st or 2nd in the regions (about 20-30 schools) . To get to Regions you had to get 1st ofr 2nd at District ( about 40 schools) I thought I was fast. And I was . We set OUR school record of 3: 18.4....but their 3:11 meant I was 70-80 yards back!... So then in 1972 as I am sitting in the F-4 Fighter jet radar repair room, I hear on the tv..(The Olympics were on)"Larry Black"... Sure enough...sombitch got the silver in the 200. My brush with fame. Ran in a race with the 2nd fastest guy in the 200 meter race in the world.
@geoffpietsch I actually ran in that record setting high school mile relay race in Gainesville 1969. I ran the same leg as Larry Black. You really really had to be something to GET to state, where there were 16 teams. To qualify, you had to be 1st or 2nd in the regions (about 20-30 schools) . To get to Regions you had to get 1st ofr 2nd at District ( about 40 schools) I thought I was fast. And I was . We set OUR school record of 3: 18.4....but their 3:11 meant I was 70-80 yards back!... So then in 1972 as I am sitting in the F-4 Fighter jet radar repair room, I hear on the tv..(The Olympics were on)"Larry Black"... Sure enough...sombitch got the silver in the 200. My brush with fame. Ran in a race with the 2nd fastest guy in the 200 meter race in the world.
11/22/2020 9:19:01 PM
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Wish you had signed your name. And school. Black not only got silver in the 200 - despite having to run out of lane 1 - but he and his cousin, Gerald Tinker, who was a Coral Gables grad, both ran on the gold medal 4x1 relay. Tinker had finished 4th in the Olympic Trials 100.
Wish you had signed your name. And school.

Black not only got silver in the 200 - despite having to run out of lane 1 - but he and his cousin, Gerald Tinker, who was a Coral Gables grad, both ran on the gold medal 4x1 relay. Tinker had finished 4th in the Olympic Trials 100.

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